My evaluation of the creatures of homm3

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zeus-online
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My evaluation of the creatures of homm3

Postby zeus-online » Nov 9 2014, 10:27

I thought i would share. Based on countless games against the AI on large and extra large maps, on the "impossible" difficulty.
I am ignoring Conflux since the town is ridiculous. List goes from best to worst.

Lvl 7:
Black dragon
Immunity to all spells combines very nicely with the powerful warlock heroes, Armageddon away! Black dragons do generally loose to the other level 7 monsters due to the inability to buff them with defensive spells or ressurect them.

Archangel
Best stats and a fairly useful ressurection ability. The plus morale ability is also very good, and means that Castle troops is the most suited to reinforce an undead army!

Titan
Best shooter in the game which gives it a strategic advantage. It also beats around half of the lvl7 upgrades in melee combat!

Gold dragon
Almost equal to the black dragon...except that rampart towns don't get Armageddon very often and their heroes are ill-suited for casting it.

Archdevil
High speed, no retaliation, so far so good....But the low HP really hurts the unit and makes it very vulnerable to damage spells.

Ancient behemoth
Most damaging unit in the game, it is pretty slow and has no immunities which means that it often just never gets into action :/

Ghost dragon
Weakest lvl7 unit in the game, weaker than the hydra. But, undead is a powerful "ability", it flies, it is much faster. And most importantly, you can create bone dragons by shoving hydra's and dragons into the skeleton transformer!
They also have an awesome trigger which always trigger in the most useless situations, unless they are used against you -_-

Chaos hydra
Slowest lvl7 unit, weak stats. Only saving grace is it's great ability to hit all units around it.


Lvl 6:
Dread knight
Higher speed and undead makes it more useful than the more powerful naga queen.

Naga queen
Beats every lvl 6 unit in a straight fight.

Efreet sultan
High speed and immunity to fire makes it very useful, more so than the more powerful champion.

Champion
All-over just a solid unit.

War unicorn
It is so cheap that i almost considered putting it above the champion.

Scorpicore
Is it a bird? Is it a plane? No! it's a mediocre flying lvl6 unit.

Cyclop king
Well, at least it shoots i guess. Looses to most units.

Wyvern Monarch
They are cheap...and you could potentially get them out turn 3...If you are either playing on a low difficulty or if you are just plain lucky.


Lvl 5:
Power lich
Undead + ranged AoE attack makes them more useful than the more powerful mighty gorgon.

Mighty gorgon
Tanky and death stare is just plain awesome.

Minotaur king
Just a solid unit. They can never have poor morale, which means that your undead army can safely pick these guys up.

Zealot
Decent shooter...but not really better than lvl 4 archmages.

Thunderbird
Fast and powerful, special ability rarely seems to trigger.

Master genie
Can buff your units, is also fairly fast and damaging. Very fragile.

Pit lord
I never found demon farming to be worth the effort. How useful they are to you depends entirely on if you consider demon farming a meaningful way to spend your time.

Dendroid
Good at protecting ranged units, keeping lvl 7 units in place. But they are too slow to really impact most battles.


Lvl 4:
Archmage
So many great abilities, no melee penalty, they do not suffer from shooting over castle walls and they make your spells cheaper. Third best ranged unit, after liches and titans.

Crusader
Insane damage for a lvl 4 unit. One of the most impact full unit in the game.

Vampire lord
This requires some explanation i think. Very powerful unit. The problem lies in their low damage which means that sometimes they just don't impact the fight very much. Extremely useful for non-hero battles. Cleans dragon cities fairly easily.

Medusa queen
Good shoter, useful in melee too!

Silver pegasi
Fast but squishy.

Ogre magi
Pretty tough unit, but too slow to really be useful.

Greater Basilisk
Well, at least it is tanky.

Horned demon
Can be massed with demon farming strategy, otherwise fairly weak.


Lvl 3:
Royal griffin
Great unit! Shield them and send them over town walls, with ressurection they can often clean everything up alone. Only lvl 3 unit that requires a lvl 4 unit spawner.

Evil eye
No melee penalty makes them more useful than grand elves in my experience.

Grand elf
Great damage, very squishy and completely useless in melee.

Cerberus
Good speed combined with AoE attack makes them very useful.

Dragon fly
High speed and dispel ability makes them fairly useful.

Iron golem
Too slow and can't be ressurected. Otherwise a fine unit.

Wraith
I rarely bother purchasing the building. Not very useful.

Orc chieftain
I once had a discussion with a friend regarding the weakest level 2 unit, and he mentioned these guys. Just plain weak.


Lvl 2:
Wolf raider
Good speed and damage, they are fairly squishy though. I recommend drawing the retaliation with a different unit before attacking with these guys.

Marksmen
Good damage and over-all a useful unit.

Harpy hag
Strike and return combined with no retaliation makes these guys very useful in siege combat.

Magog
Vastly underrated, AoE attack makes them very useful.

Battle dwarf
Tanky, but too slow to impact a lot of fights.

Obsidian gargoyle
Their great speed makes them good at blocking the town gates which can be quite the advantage for a tower army. I often use them with tactics to wall my shooters in. Even a single obsidian gargoyle might just give your titans an additional attack before being blocked by melee units/fliers.

Lizard warrior
Weak damage, squishy unit. Get's dangerous once they reach 1000's.

Zombie
I rarely bother purchasing these guys.


Lvl 1:
Skeleton
First and only un-upgraded unit to make the list. You can reach thousands of these guys with isra/vidomina which makes them the most useful lvl1 unit in my experience.

Centaur captain
Great unit! Useful from start to end.

Halberdier
Can be worth purchasing later in the game, but rarely makes the cut. Great stats and over all a very strong unit for the early-mid game.

Master gremlin
Being ranged means that they are useful for the late game, unlike most lvl1 units.

Gnoll maradeur
Pretty average.

Hobgoblin
High speed makes them a bit more useful than troglodytes.

Troglodyte
Cannot be blinded. But who in their right mind would blind these guys anyway.

Familiar
Bad stats, except for speed. Not very useful.

Agree or disagree? :)

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Postby BoardGuest808888 » Nov 11 2014, 11:58

Creature's strength really depends on the map setting where said creature is going to be used. Sure, some of them do seem a no-brainer for balance purpose. Regardless, can't say if there is any definite pointers for any creature's relative strength vs others.

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Postby cjlee » Nov 13 2014, 7:27

The awesome thing about H3 is that many creatures have abilities that really can turn the game in specific scenarios. This adds variety. Some other creatures may be useless on their own but are actually awesome in offering support to their side as… cannon fodders and meat shields. So I'm going to offer an alternative view to you Zeus; don't take it that I am parodying you because I'm just trying to show how specific uses of a unit can be very powerful and necessary to their side.


Lvl 7:
Black dragon
My take on this is that black dragons are best combined with a spellcaster rather than as brute force fighters. They can’t be buffed which can be a big disadvantage when the enemy has phantom image, prayer or slayer. At high levels, their main job is to stay alive while the hero blasts away.

Ancient behemoth
I find that to really use these guys properly I need my barbarian hero to have good spells like mass haste and dispel. Without good spells/ anti spells the behemoth is just an intimidating figure because there are so many ways he can be countered. Expert tactics on a barbarian can be countered by mass slow which all factions can use against barbarians because they all have units faster than the thunderbird. An unwise barbarian/ barbarian who knows no magic is disadvantaged still!

Ghost dragon
The main purpose of these guys is to exist. So that you the necromancer can cast nasty spells. The ghost dragons are fragile otherwise.

Chaos hydra
The most dangerous use of these guys is when defending at close quarters in a siege. I really don’t know how Fortress players can play well; its some kind of magic that I’ve never figured out. Without teleport, the Chaos Hydra is useless when you are the attacker. I don't like to rely on one spell.

Lvl 6:

Naga queen
My favourite high level experience farm. They’re pretty useless without an enemy hero to support them and fetch tons of experience with lower risk than other units.

War unicorn
You need to buy them to bolster your otherwise weak Rampart lineup. You can’t rush to war with dendroids and dwarves!

Cyclop king
Really very painful to get hit by them. They’re part of a balanced barbarian army.

Wyvern Monarch
It seems they are the main damage dealers for fortress and some players can use them very well. But not me.


Lvl 5:
Power lich
Undead + low HP and slow speed makes them a magnet for damaging spells and enemy castle turrets. These guys don’t stay undead long…

Thunderbird
Weak unit that is useful only as a one trick horse. Use them to kill the main enemy of certain factions (eg target the elves when besieging Rampart, and the cyclopses when attacking another stronghold). Otherwise they get killed fast and are perpetually going where the rest of your army can’t follow.

Master genie
Has only 2 purposes for me. One is to buff my side. The other is to fly in and block enemy shooters.

Pit lord
These guys do a lot more damage on their own, than they can as demon farmers.

Dendroid
Their impact on battles is a tactical one. You need them to anchor incoming enemy fliers, then defend, while the elves walk away and shoot at close range. There is no reason to buy them unless you are being invaded.


Lvl 4:

Ogre magi
These guys tend to stay alive pretty long, so I find they have a triple purpose. First is to cast bloodlust on thunderbirds and behemoths. Second is to stay alive while castle defences whittle down the enemy. Last is to go into battle when the enemy approaches the cyclopses.


Lvl 3:

Dragon fly
High speed and dispel ability makes them essential to the Fortress faction. I can easily play fortress without gnolls and lizards, but not dragonflies.

Iron golem
Like battle dwarf their job is to keep the ranged attackers alive rather than to attempt crossing the battlefield.

Wraith
In small battles, the wraith is invincible. EG level 1-4 units can’t defeat a wraith in a 1 on 1 combat. The wraith strategy is to bring a few and have your hero do the real spell damage until you can get better units. Also very lethal in battles where you are facing an enemy hero with low knowledge.

Orc chieftain
These guys have their own uses. As meat shields for the raiders and goblins. When you field them the AI likes to target them, which is good, because the real damage is done by the wolf raiders who have fewer hit points.


Lvl 2:
Wolf raider
Due to low HP, my favourite is to target them with spells. Even a weak spellcaster can always dispatch a few.

Harpy hag
My favourite level 2. Incredibly dangerous in the hands of a good human player due to their abilities. I have great fun when fighting the AI and no such great fun when fighting my friends.


Battle dwarf
Not meant to be fast. Meant to cover your elves’ asses. They take forever to cross the battlefield.

Obsidian gargoyle
The main purpose of an obsidian gargoyle is to ‘get into position’. Whether it is to protect your shooters, or to harass the enemy’s. These guys have practically no attack capability. Same as H5 gargoyles.

Lizard warrior
Like most fortress units, lousy for blitzing, but when defending a castle they are harder to kill than most level 1-3 ranged due to their stats. So when I play fortress I tend not to buy them unless I am facing invasion.



Lvl 1:
Skeleton
Their slow speed and Necropolis’ inability to get water magic (teleport) means that unless I’m facing a competent human player, skeletons are for farming experience.

Master gremlin
Being ranged means that they are perpetually being targeted by AI. They rarely live until late game.

Gnoll maradeur
I’m not good with fortress, but some people like them so probably they have their uses.

Hobgoblin
Because they come in big numbers and each can do 1 damage, on a high attack barbarian hero they are very painful.

Troglodyte
Always disregarded. That’s fine. Real damage is dealt by the warlock. Their job is just to stay alive. Who cares if they can’t walk fast? They are not meant to rush into battle. If you wanna run around, that’s what harpy hags are for! The fact that they cannot be blinded means that as long as they are alive, the warlock gets to cast spells! This is extremely useful until the warlock gets dragons.

Familiar
They move fast and can go places. I always have a few stacks of one each in my army – to steal retaliations and to suck enemy mana. Inferno guys are hard hitting but lack HP, so you really need the familiars to be the fall guys!

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Re: My evaluation of the creatures of homm3

Postby Pitsu » Nov 14 2014, 13:48

zeus-online wrote:I thought i would share. Based on countless games against the AI on large and extra large maps, on the "impossible" difficulty.


One would learn a lot by breaking his habits.

zeus-online wrote:Archdevil
High speed, no retaliation, so far so good....But the low HP really hurts the unit and makes it very vulnerable to damage spells.


Against AI the best creature. Speed, no retal and the wait command in battles makes it perfect for hit and run. If combined with expert slow, force-field and rescurrection, a stack of archdevils can deal with incredible odds and need help from other units only in a few situations.

zeus-online wrote:Efreet sultan
High speed and immunity to fire makes it very useful, more so than the more powerful champion.


Armageddon again. Since devils rarely need any help from other units and efreets with armageddon need no other units, inferno produces simultaneously two armies that both cut through most opponents.

zeus-online wrote:Cyclop king
Well, at least it shoots i guess. Looses to most units.


The main problem is that their dwelling requires crystals and you have to chose between cyclops and behemoths. The latter always wins and cyclops are underused and therefore underrated.

zeus-online wrote:Wyvern Monarch
They are cheap...and you could potentially get them out turn 3...If you are either playing on a low difficulty or if you are just plain lucky.


While against AI one can play in whatever way, expanding speed is crucial and wyverns with their early appearance can get you going faster than enemy.

zeus-online wrote:Thunderbird
Fast and powerful, special ability rarely seems to trigger.


As with wyrvens rocs are available fast and help you to get going. Therefore they are key units for their faction.

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Re: My evaluation of the creatures of homm3

Postby zeus-online » Nov 14 2014, 23:27

Pitsu wrote:
zeus-online wrote:I thought i would share. Based on countless games against the AI on large and extra large maps, on the "impossible" difficulty.


One would learn a lot by breaking his habits.

Well, i play homm3 to relax and have fun. I have more fun when i play larger maps. Also, if i am playing against the AI (Which i usually am) i pretty much always win regardless of which map i choose.

Pitsu wrote:
zeus-online wrote:Archdevil
High speed, no retaliation, so far so good....But the low HP really hurts the unit and makes it very vulnerable to damage spells.


Against AI the best creature. Speed, no retal and the wait command in battles makes it perfect for hit and run. If combined with expert slow, force-field and rescurrection, a stack of archdevils can deal with incredible odds and need help from other units only in a few situations.

Yeah, they are quite good. All i said is that their low HP hurts them a lot. All the lvl 7 upgrades are strong.

Pitsu wrote:
zeus-online wrote:Efreet sultan
High speed and immunity to fire makes it very useful, more so than the more powerful champion.


Armageddon again. Since devils rarely need any help from other units and efreets with armageddon need no other units, inferno produces simultaneously two armies that both cut through most opponents.

I often times just use efreets and devils on my main hero when i play inferno, this gives incredible movement speed. This in turns allows me to explore faster and thus i get a move powerful hero and more resources to build up my town.
I don't like inferno much though.

Pitsu wrote:
zeus-online wrote:Cyclop king
Well, at least it shoots i guess. Looses to most units.


The main problem is that their dwelling requires crystals and you have to chose between cyclops and behemoths. The latter always wins and cyclops are underused and therefore underrated.

That too, but i also find them quite underwhelming compared to other shooters and other lvl6 units.

Pitsu wrote:
zeus-online wrote:Wyvern Monarch
They are cheap...and you could potentially get them out turn 3...If you are either playing on a low difficulty or if you are just plain lucky.


While against AI one can play in whatever way, expanding speed is crucial and wyverns with their early appearance can get you going faster than enemy.

Purchasing them early can be difficult on the impossible difficulty since you start with such low resources. Also, on larger maps it is more difficult to rush the opponent since they will have a week or so to purchase a defense.

Pitsu wrote:
zeus-online wrote:Thunderbird
Fast and powerful, special ability rarely seems to trigger.


As with wyrvens rocs are available fast and help you to get going. Therefore they are key units for their faction.

Well, yes. That does not mean that they are the best lvl 5 units though ;)

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Re: My evaluation of the creatures of homm3

Postby cjlee » Nov 17 2014, 13:43

Archdevil:

methinks the low HP is necessary because he can strike without retaliation. One on one without Hero assistance, Archdevil is lethal to most opposing units since they can strike and return next turn.

I see them and inferno in general (H4, H5 and even H6 to some extent) as a glass cannon faction. They are incredibly dangerous in some situations, but vulnerable in others.

AI loves targeting the Archdevils and I hate that. But I've also found Archdevils don't really need high numbers. As long as you can cast slow or force field, in the vast majority of situations they will be able to whittle down the enemy over time.

As you observed, Devils form a good army on their own, and Efreets another army on their own. That's the glass cannon strategy. It crushes all your opponents until you run into... Black Dragons, Rampart or Haven faction, any of which will shatter you. Of course by that point you should hopefully have a vast army of demons and hell hounds bringing up the rear.

Cyclops vs Behemoths

I actually find cyclopes better when fighting against AI. I eventually realized why, after seeing how Chinese gamers on Ultra Difficult maps take my strategies to ridiculous extents.

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Postby Paulus1 » Nov 17 2014, 23:50

It's been ages since I really played HoMM3, but a few thoughts.

Cyclops are really expensive, but they are an essential unit for the Stronghold. Most of the other units are high-damage but slow ground pounders. Cyclopses give a needed ranged attack (orcs are weak), so the enemy has to come to you.
They also helps bring down castle gates in sieges, clearing the way for the Behemoths to attack.

Fortress is a very different beast than any other town, with a heavy emphasis on defense. They are a pain to bring down in sieges.
The key to a succesfull battle is to unleash the Mighty Gorgons on the enemys lvl 7 creatures, while the Hydras clear up the lower levels.

Grand elves are the best lvl3 creature IMO, and an essential high damage shooter for the Rampart. Very effective in clearing the early map and thus progressing.

An army of efreets and devils together is quite a waste. Efreets alone with an armageddon hero is more effective in 95% of battles.
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Re: My evaluation of the creatures of homm3

Postby BoardGuest808888 » Nov 21 2014, 11:28

zeus-online wrote:
Pitsu wrote:
zeus-online wrote:Cyclop king
Well, at least it shoots i guess. Looses to most units.


The main problem is that their dwelling requires crystals and you have to chose between cyclops and behemoths. The latter always wins and cyclops are underused and therefore underrated.

That too, but i also find them quite underwhelming compared to other shooters and other lvl6 units.


Other than Titan, can u name which ranged unit better than Cyclops King ?

On other note, Skeleton and Skeleton Warrior are never a good unit. It is Necromancy which make them good. So it is more a quality of Hero-Skill-Alignment instead of the unit by itself.

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Re: My evaluation of the creatures of homm3

Postby zeus-online » Nov 23 2014, 13:37

BoardGuest808888 wrote:
zeus-online wrote:
Pitsu wrote:
zeus-online wrote:Cyclop king
Well, at least it shoots i guess. Looses to most units.


The main problem is that their dwelling requires crystals and you have to chose between cyclops and behemoths. The latter always wins and cyclops are underused and therefore underrated.

That too, but i also find them quite underwhelming compared to other shooters and other lvl6 units.


Other than Titan, can u name which ranged unit better than Cyclops King ?

On other note, Skeleton and Skeleton Warrior are never a good unit. It is Necromancy which make them good. So it is more a quality of Hero-Skill-Alignment instead of the unit by itself.

None of the other ranged units can beat the cyclops in a straight fight, if that is what you mean. As far as usefulness is concerned i think archmages and power liches are more useful, although obviously not on a 1 for 1 basis.
Taking necromancy into account is just as viable as taking spells into account.


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